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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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I enlarged the map of the homes and while they range from Burton to Beecher, the greatest concentration is along M L KIng and from Sloan to Edwards. The company is Payne Investments.
Package of 58 Flint houses for sale on eBay
Published: Thursday, January 06, 2011, 7:00 AM
By Kristin Longley | Flint Journal
Joseph Tobianski l The Flint Journal
The house at 161 E. Eldridge Ave. in Flint is one of 58 houses for sale on eBay.
FLINT, Michigan — Looking for a house in Flint? How about 58 of them?
Anyone with an Internet connection could snatch them all for a cool $92,800.
An Illinois-based investment company is trying unload dozens of houses in a package deal on eBay for more than three times what it paid for them at a Michigan public land auction.
But buyers beware: The houses could be in poor condition, and at least a few of the previous owners likely abandoned them knowing the houses were worth less than the taxes owed, local officials said.
It’s a scenario officials said is hard to avoid in today’s depressed housing market: An out-of-state speculator grabbing up homes for pennies on the dollar and then trying to flip them online for a quick profit to someone who may not be familiar with Flint real estate.
The situation is made even more unusual because buyers have to bid on a 58-house package, instead of individual properties, said Doug Weiland, executive director of the Genesee County Land Bank. The houses are scattered all over the city, with a few in Mt. Morris.
“These are people who could have no idea what they’re buying,” Weiland said of potential bidders. “It’s a very, very tough market. It’s a tough situation.”
The company, Payne Investments out of La Grange, Ill., purchased the tax-foreclosed properties individually at an auction for a total of $25,350 in November, according to auction records.
The company bought the houses for as little as $100 each, and none for more than $850 — much less than the $1,600 apiece that the eBay listing is selling them for.
Attempts to reach officials with Payne Investments were unsuccessful this week.
The November auction was held by the Genesee County treasurer’s office as required by state law, said county Treasurer Deborah Cherry. The county has to accept the highest bid no matter what, she said.
As of Wednesday afternoon, the eBay listing had one bid of $92,800.
The listing’s description makes it clear the houses are sold “as is” and the current conditions of the properties are unknown, but it also markets the homes as ideal rental properties.
The listing also reports the average home sale price in the Flint/Grand Blanc area as $229,933, which appears to be from a 2005 CNNmoney.com article.
“These homes have tremendous value as an investment,” the listing says.
Weiland said that’s “ridiculous.” He also said the houses’ combined value of $1,461,200 could be misleading to someone browsing the listing who has no knowledge of the Flint housing market, he said.
“It may look like it has $20,000 or $30,000 in value when it’s really a bombed out mess,” Weiland said.
Weiland said the market has changed drastically from just a few years ago.
The average home in Flint sold for $59,000 in 2005. Last year, the average sale price was just $15,000, he said.
The Genesee County Land Bank was created in 2004, in large part to prevent tax-foreclosed properties from ending up in the hands of speculators.
In this case, however, the investment company purchased the homes in person at the state auction, before the homes would have reverted to the Land Bank’s control.
Cherry said the county will watch the eBay auction to see what happens.
“If I were buying them, I would do as much due diligence as possible ... to see what kind of work they may need,” she said. “I hope they’re purchased by someone who’s going to use them in a positive way.”
But the statistics don’t look good.
Weiland said that of all the properties in previous years that have been sold at auction, one-third of them have come back to the county because of foreclosure for unpaid taxes one or more times.
“The problem is as long as people are able to buy these cheap at auction, they’re going to continue to sell them like this,” he said. “It continues to leave the community in flux.”
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Comments
xrayspecs January 06, 2011 at 7:18AM
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Good grief, every one of these houses is in Flint's north end armpit and I'll bet few if any are more than gutted shells.
I have no sympathy for anyone who buys Flint houses online, sight unseen, thinking they're getting a good deal. Not now that we have this internet thingie...a ten-minute search and google street view would provide a pretty good idea of what these houses are really worth.
jacobsmith January 06, 2011 at 7:22AM
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If someone buys this they DESERVE IT. I have a fully functional, taxes up to date home in the city of Flint that I would sell for 2/3rds of what I owe any day of the week.
Harold Taco January 06, 2011 at 7:29AM
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I used to support the Land Bank. Now I consider that the only difference between them and another slumlord is you can sue the slumlord, but it is much harder to sue the Land Bank.
Junky renters next door? Well the land bank is now the landlord so good luck suing them for anything.
greattakestate January 06, 2011 at 7:36AM
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Maybe the Chinese will buy them! They seem to own everything else in America.
justicesearc January 06, 2011 at 7:37AM
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"a few of the previous owners likely abandoned them knowing the houses were worth less than the taxes owed" - This statement says it all to me. Perhaps if the assessments were done ACCURATELY people would not walk away.
"The Genesee County Land Bank was created in 2004, in large part to prevent tax-foreclosed properties from ending up in the hands of speculators." - NO the statement of purpose from the land bank web site is "The Land Bank mission is to restore value to the community by acquiring, developing and selling vacant and abandoned properties" - this does not mean to buy, hold and wait for a friend to need a sweetheart deal - it does not mean to keep the properties and watch them fall apart - they are to SELL them.
asuccubus January 06, 2011 at 7:41AM
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I wish someone would prohibit this type of sale (and purchase). I'm so sick of a basic necessity, housing, being treated like any other commodity. And it's absolutely disgusting that people like this profit from others' misery. The pox upon them.
Last edited by untanglingwebs on Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:02 am; edited 1 time in total |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 7:57 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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The November auction was held by the Genesee County treasurer’s office as required by state law, said county Treasurer Deborah Cherry. The county has to accept the highest bid no matter what, she said.
In 2009 the houses to be auctioned were in the Civic Park historic area and all needed to be torn down. Wonder if the auction mentioned the status of the homes.
Were all reverted properties on the auction block. Sometimes the Treasurer clusters homes for a high bid package. |
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:05 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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This is the first house i looked at on the City of Flint website. It is posted (condemned) and has taxes owing.
40-01-307-006
Address:
605 W NEWALL ST
Status:
Posted
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Owner:
PAYNE INVESTMENTS, LLC
PO BOX 551
LA GRANGE, IL 60525
Classification:
Residential Improved
Zoning District:
A-2
Lot Size:
Front: 50 Depth: 85
Current Year (2010)
Previous Year (2009)
State Equalized Value
7500 16300
Taxable Value
7500 16300
Homestead%
0 0
2010 Taxes
Summer Taxes
Winter Taxes
Original Tax
$414.48 $80.74
Penalty
$13.80 $0.00
Water Lien
$505.22
Special
$0.00 $0.00
Paid To Date
$0.00 $0.00
Balance Due
$933.50 $80.74 |
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:17 am |
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Dave Starr
F L I N T O I D
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:08 am |
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00SL2
F L I N T O I D
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"The November auction was held by the Genesee County treasurer’s office as required by state law, said county Treasurer Deborah Cherry.
The county has to accept the highest bid no matter what,
she said."
Source: http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2011/01/package_of_58_flint_houses_for.html
------------
I'd like to know what law says the county has to accept the highest bid. That's asinine. If there's fraud involved on the part of the buyer where does that leave the county?
I checked the first 18 Flint properties listed on ebay. Of those, 6 are listed POSTED, some have water liens. The ebay site shows "assessed value" at twice the amount of the State Equalized Value; thus, the "assessed value" published on ebay is only the supposed true "market value." Fraud, anyone?
Check on the ebay seller:
LLC MEMBERS
Entity Name PAYNE INVESTMENTS LLC File Number 03377512
Name Address
PAYNE, KYLE 405 S. MADISON, LA GRANGE, IL - 60525
Source: http://www.ilsos.gov/corporatellc/CorporateLlcController?command=mms&fileNbr=03377512&type=MBR
Accessed: January 6, 2011
LLC FILE DETAIL REPORT
Entity Name PAYNE INVESTMENTS LLC File Number 03377512
Status ACTIVE On 09/10/2010
Entity Type LLC Type of LLC Domestic
File Date 09/10/2010 Jurisdiction IL
Agent Name UNITED STATES CORP AGENTS INC
Agent Change Date 11/12/2010
Agent Street Address 6049 DEMPSTER ST Principal Office 405 S. MADISON
LA GRANGE, IL 605250000
Agent City MORTON GROVE Management Type MBR View
Agent Zip 60053 Duration PERPETUAL
Annual Report Filing Date 00/00/0000 For Year
Series Name NOT AUTHORIZED TO ESTABLISH SERIES
Source: http://www.ilsos.gov/corporatellc/CorporateLlcController
Accessed: January 6, 2011
CORPORATION/LLC SEARCH RESULTS
Search Criteria: PAYNE INVESTMENTS
Entity Type File Number Corporation/LLC Name
CORP MST 63961655 PAYNE INVESTMENTS/CREATIVE DYNAMICS INC.
LLC MST 03377512 PAYNE INVESTMENTS LLC
CORP MST 63156299 PAYNE INVESTMENTS LTD.
http://www.ilsos.gov/corporatellc/CorporateLlcController
CORPORATION FILE DETAIL REPORT
Entity Name PAYNE INVESTMENTS/CREATIVE DYNAMICS INC. File Number 63961655
Status DISSOLVED
Entity Type CORPORATION Type of Corp DOMESTIC BCA
Incorporation Date (Domestic) 12/15/2004 State ILLINOIS
Agent Name CORPORATE FILING SOLUTIONS Agent Change Date 12/15/2004
Agent Street Address 1415 W 22ND ST TOWER FL President Name & Address
Agent City OAKBROOK Secretary Name & Address INVOLUNTARY DISSOLUTION 05 01 06
Agent Zip 60523 Duration Date PERPETUAL
Annual Report Filing Date 00/00/0000 For Year 2005
CORPORATION FILE DETAIL REPORT
Entity Name PAYNE INVESTMENTS LTD. File Number 63156299
Status DISSOLVED
Entity Type CORPORATION Type of Corp DOMESTIC BCA
Incorporation Date (Domestic) 10/23/2003 State ILLINOIS
Agent Name CURTIS PAYNE Agent Change Date 10/23/2003
Agent Street Address 3750 GREEN ST APT 7 President Name & Address
Agent City STEGER Secretary Name & Address INVOLUNTARY DISSOLUTION 03 01 05
Agent Zip 60475 Duration Date PERPETUAL
Annual Report Filing Date 00/00/0000 For Year 2004 |
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 1:19 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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| Excellent research. Obviously the Treasurer's Office doe not have to determine if the purchaser is a legitimate entity. |
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:22 pm |
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00SL2
F L I N T O I D
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| Federal authorities should put an immediate stop to foreign entities trying to peddle condemned properties POSTED for demolition! City offices, County Treasurer and Register of Deeds offices should have condemned and to-be-demolished properties red-flagged for NO SALE!! |
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Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:27 pm |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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The Treasurers office and Land Bank have conflicting rules. If I bought a Land bank home, I would have to pay a significant amount of money to cover the "fair market value". Often a home that is in really bad shape will be offered for more than anyone would be willing to pay.
Can't the Treasurer's office require these out of town speculators to at least pay the back taxes. When these taxes are not paid, the tax burden falls back on the city and the payment (albeit a low one) goes to the Treasurer. The community in which the property is located appears to be getting screwed. |
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Fri Jan 07, 2011 8:47 am |
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Dave Starr
F L I N T O I D
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| Bidding has been ended, no reason given. |
_________________
I used to care, but I take a pill for that now.
Pushing buttons sure can be fun.
When a lion wants to go somewhere, he doesn’t worry about how many hyenas are in the way.
Paddle faster, I hear banjos. |
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Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:31 am |
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theboyzmom
F L I N T O I D
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quote:
untanglingwebs schreef:
The Treasurers office and Land Bank have conflicting rules. If I bought a Land bank home, I would have to pay a significant amount of money to cover the "fair market value". Often a home that is in really bad shape will be offered for more than anyone would be willing to pay.
Can't the Treasurer's office require these out of town speculators to at least pay the back taxes. When these taxes are not paid, the tax burden falls back on the city and the payment (albeit a low one) goes to the Treasurer. The community in which the property is located appears to be getting screwed.
The problem is that when the county takes posession of the homes, all back taxes are eliminated.
I personally would NEVER buy another property from either the land bank or at the auction. Once being screwed by the county deciding to take a property back MONTHS after it was sold and after I fixed it up was enough for me. Would not have been so bad if the county had offered to pay me for the work we did - but no - the former owner got the property back in better shape than it was when he decided to let the taxes slide. |
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Sat Jan 08, 2011 9:41 am |
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theboyzmom
F L I N T O I D
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| I am confused that NO ONE brought up the fact that the COUNTY has them assessed at so much money when they are tagged for demolition. How could the county, in good faith, charge the former owners huge tax rates? Why did the assessors not lower the assessments before the county took them if they were really in such bad condition. remember the law is that the property should be assessed at the CURRENT MARKET VALUE. If the house is to be demolished how can it have a value of $10 or $20 thousand dollars - I know empty lots in the city do not go for that. This is the same problem that led to the Genesee Towers debacle. When will the people of this county stand up and MAKE the assessors do their jobs? |
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Sat Jan 08, 2011 9:47 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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It is the Flint assessment office that sets the value for the homes in Flint. They only assess them every few years in area by area.
Although a home is posted, it can be taken off the demolition list if the items on the list from the building inspector iare repaired with proper permits. Some non profits have purchased severely damaged homes and repaired them.
Land bank homes in Carriage Town were gutted down to the frame and rebuilt. Kildee called them "habbs" because there was so little left to rehab. |
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Sat Jan 08, 2011 10:57 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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A recent article stated average selling price for homes in Flint around $16,000 Land Bank wants more than that for some city lots.
40-01-101-006 609 W PASADENA AVE FLINT 48505 $31,700 Res Imp
40-01-101-020 522 W DEWEY ST FLINT 48505 $15,100 Res Imp
40-01-102-033 3307 MASON ST FLINT 48505 $24,300 Res Imp
40-01-103-019 530 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 $44,200 Res Imp
40-01-104-003 IROQUOIS AVE FLINT 48505 $400 Res Vac Lot
40-01-104-027 324 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 $12,100 Res Imp
40-01-104-031 3217 MASON ST FLINT 48505 $33,400 Res Imp
40-01-104-037 402 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 $35,400 Res Imp
40-01-105-024 611 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 $52,300 Res Imp
40-01-106-002 3114 IROQUOIS AVE FLINT 48505 $26,200 Res Imp
40-01-106-030 0 MASON ST FLINT 48505 $800 Res Vac Lot
40-01-126-004 217 W PASADENA AVE FLINT 48505 $400 Res Vac Lot
40-01-126-016 228 W DEWEY ST FLINT 48505 $800 Res Vac Lot
40-01-127-019 220 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 $3,800 Res Imp
40-01-127-020 216 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 $49,100 Res Imp
40-01-128-009 133 W JAMIESON ST FLINT 48505 to be determined Res Vac Lot
40-01-128-032 3117 M L KING AVE FLINT 48505 $27,100 Res Imp
40-01-129-004 221 W MC CLELLAN ST FLINT 48505 $36,300 Res Imp
40-01-129-019 220 W GENESEE ST FLINT 48505 $800 Res Vac Lot
40-01-129-029 W GENESEE ST FLINT 48505 $800 Res Vac Lot
40-01-129-031 W GENESEE ST FLINT 48505 $800 Res Vac Lot
40-01-129-036 3001 M L KING AVE FLINT 48505 $50,000 Res Imp
40-01-151-012 606 W TAYLOR ST FLINT 48505 $200 Res Vac Lot
< previous page page 32 of 214 (listings 776-800) next page >
© 2004 Genesee County Land Bank – All rights reserved.
This site powered by Community Center™ software from Land Information Access Association |
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Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:03 am |
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untanglingwebs
El Supremo
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This house is still in the Treasurers name. Treasurer wants $49,100. House sold for $10,000 on a conventional mortgage in 1996 and $67,000 in 2004. Check out the City of Flint assessed value which is less than $10,000.
I checked the taxes for this block and only one resident has paid this years taxes. Two were Treasurer owned and one MSHDA owned. One was owned by someone out of the country. Not a block many would be interested in buying into as it is in the middle of the journal's murder row.
Parcel #:
40-01-127-020
Address:
216 W JAMIESON ST
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Owner:
GENESEE COUNTY TREASURER
1101 BEACH ST
FLINT, MI 48502
Classification:
Residential Improved
Zoning District:
A-2
Lot Size:
Front: 50 Depth: 110
Current Year (2010)
Previous Year (2009)
State Equalized Value
4500 5000
Taxable Value
4500 5000
Homestead%
0 0
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010 Taxes
Summer Taxes
Winter Taxes
Original Tax
$248.68 $48.44
Penalty
$3.72 $0.00
Water Lien
$0.00
Special
$0.00 $0.00
Paid To Date
$0.00 $0.00
Balance Due
$252.40 $48.44
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EFFECTIVE MARCH 2, 2010 ALL REAL PROPERTY TAXES FOR 2009 AND PRIOR YEARS ARE PAYABLE AT THE GENESEE COUNTY TREASURER'S OFFICE, 1101 BEACH STREET
Search Genesee County Delinquent Tax Information
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Style: TWO STORY
Year Built: 1937
square Footage: 1790
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Last Updated: 1/8/2011
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
City of Flint
© 1/9/2011
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Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:13 am |
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